While many are fleeing New York City to their country homes, some diehard New Yorkers remained loyal and local in the wake of the pandemic. In fashion, we have found talent that are resilient, have committed to making New York their home, and work around the new normal. We sat down in conversation with one such designer, Neil Grotzinger, of eponymous brand NIHL, a fashion provocateur whose first collection was the talk of industry with his Parsons MFA Collection. The collection consisted of redefining male silhouettes, frayed knitting, and wrestling singlets walking down the runway.
In our conversation, we discuss with this rising star the difference between sexuality and sensuality, the need to work sustainably and ethically, as well his sources of inspiration. Speaking with Neil is like talking to that friend you haven’t seen in years, in which the conversation resumes as if no time has passed.
Alfredo:
Where are you right now? Where are you taking this call from?
Neil:
I’m home. I’m in my apartment in Crown Heights, where I have been working throughout the pandemic. I built up a little studio in my living room, so I’m just sewing away.
Alfredo:
You didn’t leave New York City at all during COVID?
Neil:
No, I’ve chosen to be quarantined in my apartment the entire time.
Alfredo:
Is NIHL a play on your name or is it an acronym for something?
Neil:
It’s funny. I always get this question. It’s kind of a play on my name and it actually came about as a joke that I came up with when I was in college with some of my friends when we got stoned, laughing about what we would call our brands in the future. This is going to sound silly, but it was the idea that a high-end luxury brand has to be difficult to pronounce like Lanvin, so I just decided to respell my name.
Alfredo:
But, it is pronounced Neil?
Neil:
No, uh…yeah.
Alfredo:
Now that we clarified that, [or didn’t,] how would you describe your personal style? Is it very much like NIHL? For instance, are you walking around in a crochet jockstrap?
Neil:
I wish I had the confidence to wear my clothes all the time. I do wear them occasionally when I’m going out or if I want to get really dressed up. I do definitely dress very colorfully and I definitely like to wear somewhat subversive clothing. I wear a lot of vintage women’s clothing, like old women’s blouses that I think are made out of interesting fabrics or prints and that are funny and interesting. So, there is an influence from my brand that trickles into my personal style, but I guess it’s toned down, like the subversive weird separates that I like to wear.
Alfredo:
How do you find the pieces that you personally wear?
Neil:
Thrift stores and eBay. Oftentimes they start out as initial references and inspiration for a collection where I’ll go to a thrift store just because I have a very specific idea for a very specific area in mind that I want to reference in a particular collection, and buy certain things just because I want to be able to look at them closer.
Alfredo:
Well it’s great that you are recycling and upcycling your collections because a lot of fashion ends up in landfills.
Neil:
Exactly. I’m glad you pointed that out. Yes, it’s very true. And even looks within the collection will sometimes be made literally out of repurposed vintage garments or dead stock fabrics that I’ll find.
Alfredo:
Early in your career, you worked as an embroidery designer for iconic brands, such as Diane Von Furstenberg and Marc Jacobs. What did you learn from your experiences in these houses and how does your experience with them influence your own design aesthetic now?
Neil:
Working for both of those companies was amazing in terms of seeing how a larger fashion business is run. My first job working in the industry was working for Diane Von Furstenberg. I think what I learned there was how to demonstrate and translate my ideas and filter them into someone else’s perspective – through a different lens. It was interesting because most of it consisted of me sort communicating ideas through illustration that someone else would then turn into an embroidery. It taught me how to take my style and infuse it into something that I know that someone else will like. Working for Marc Jacobs was also an amazing experience just because it’s just such a creative environment and everyone is so enthusiastic about what they do. And they’re constantly on new ideas, right up until the last second when they’re actually putting on the fashion show. It’s just cool and exciting to be in an environment like that. I think that my biggest take away from that experience was the energy.
Alfredo:
COVID has slowed down a lot of the production and companies are reevaluating how they’re producing collections, with many creating pieces that customers will be able to have for a longer time, instead of just creating a lot of seasonal or trend pieces. Has COVID had a similar impact on you?
Neil:
It definitely has rewired my thinking. I agree that a lot of people are trying to reevaluate the constant output of fashion, where it just seems like we don’t necessarily need to be doing this much all the time. Because of COVID, I lost the use of my studio. I said to myself, ‘what do I even do? How do I even come up with a collection for the upcoming season?’ But since embroidery and hand bead work have always been something that I’m fascinated by, I realized that I could just sit in my kitchen and embroider. But it has definitely forced me to rethink what a fashion collection has to be. For the past few seasons, I’ve been consistently told by a lot of people that I need to focus more on sales and create pieces that are more wearable or more accessible, but at the same time, I want to see out my visions and I still want things to be as over the top and exaggerated and subversive as I want them to be. Items that are made specifically for a male torso can be difficult pitch to a wholesaler because there’s no category for that in their buying options. If I create my own platform where maybe there’s some sort of new rental service, where more people can access this one of a kind thing, it could upend the thinking in fashion that couture is only for one kind of customer.
Alfredo:
Where do you draw a lot of your inspiration from, for your collections and how do you decide the silhouettes?
Neil:
It really depends on the season. It always starts with one very initial idea or one focus point. The collection from the previous season that you guys just photographed, was all very inspired by this idea of queer characters in horror films and the philosophy around queerness being projected as a villain character in film. I was just really fascinated with that idea. It started with just me watching a lot of very specific horror films that I felt had sort of problematic queer characters within them, or problematic villains that had queer attributes.
Alfredo:
When I saw Hannibal Lecter walking down the runway in your show, I said to myself “he’s hot,” but we’re talking about Hannibal Lecter here. Your collections are not only redefining sexuality and gender, but it also plays on sensuality and the erotic. What elements do you think separate a sensual and sexual collection? What is that fine line?
Neil:
That is a very interesting question. It’s something that I definitely do try to address. I think sexuality we might consider taboo or we might consider extreme, but in a lot of my clothes, I just try to find a way to maybe make it seem more like something that someone would casually wear, but not being overtly sexual. I guess sensual to me is kind of coy, or kind of implying sexuality without actually revealing it. I think I’m always trying to be somewhere in the middle, where certain looks are skirting the line of what you might consider to be appropriate, but also demand that question again, of, ‘why do you consider this to be inappropriate?’ Is it because it’s actually overtly sexual or because it’s taboo?
Alfredo:
Are you inspired by any era?
Neil:
Yeah, definitely. Right now for this collection I’m working on, I’m really inspired by Las Vegas in the eighties and nineties. I think that there’s something hedonistic about that period. I think that there is some historical element to almost every collection that I do. And it’s about taking the historical out of context to create a new way of looking at the past. I think there’s something really interesting about referencing things from the past that are sort of embedded in our memory. It’s fascinating to me and the way that we exaggerate those qualities of those ideas.
Alfredo: You have described your collection as “Masculine Effeminacy.” What do you want people to understand from that label? What does it mean?
Neil: I came up with that label because I’m fascinated with this idea of, “Effeminacy.” I see it being a male term or a male-associated term. You describe a woman as feminine, but you describe a man as effeminate, which is often used in a negative context, in which people are citing attributes of a feminine man that they find distasteful or that they are think are strange. It’s an interesting term to appropriate and convert into something empowering that someone can sort of embrace within themselves. The masculine and feminine can coexist within the same person: masculinity doesn’t have to cancel out femininity within someone. They can exist side by side in an interesting way.
Alfredo:
When you design a collection, do you have a market in mind or is it more of a social or political statement?
Neil:
I am always trying to make a very specific statement with the collection. I always want people to understand it within the greater context of something. In terms of my market, I’m always focused on a queer customer, just because I think that that it is a relatively underrepresented consumer in retail. It’s very difficult to find interesting clothing that’s specifically made for queer person. And because queer identity is so varied and complex, I feel like we don’t even fully understand it yet and maybe never will.
Alfredo:
Who would you like to see dressed in your clothing?
Neil:
I’ve really always wanted to dress ARCA. I think she is amazing. I think she’s a genius and I just love her overall perspective. I would love to see her wear anything!
In connection with this interview, The Know commissioned multidisciplinary artist, Olimpia Dior, to produce to an editorial featuring brother and sister Arton and Arta Gee. The siblings Arta and Arton Gee are models from New York, whose professional careers often have them splitting time between the Big Apple and Los Angeles. Arta’s work in fashion seems to take her everywhere though, walking shows for Vivienne Westwood, Helmut Lang, Namilia, and dozens of other edgy brands. In addition to his modeling work, Arton is currently working on a few creative projects, exploring filmmaking and creative direction. “I have always been interested in the perspective and life experience of others, using a lens of queerness, so my work will be steeped in narratives of that nature. My home is in Chelsea, in what used to be an old knitting mill through much of the 1900s. I find a lot of inspiration on my walks and runs throughout downtown and along the Hudson River,” he says. On working with his sister, Arta, “It’s always exciting working with her since she’s truly my best friend, confidant, and role model. She has a very clear vision and everyone around her finds comfort in that confidence, so I always feel like I can be my truest and best self in that space.” Apparently the admiration is mutual and results in creative synergy in their shared work. “I feel like we always feed off of each other’s energy,” according to Arta.
Photographer & Director : Olimpia Dior
Stylist: Masha Orlov
Interview: Alfredo Mineo
Cinematographer : Courtney Denk